The Diminishing Employer Demand for the Traditional MBA

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

Andrew Crisp, Co-Founder at CarringtonCrisp , joined the podcast to discuss their recent study, The Future of Lifelong and Executive Education , and the reinvention of the traditional MBA that employers are demanding.

Every company is a digital business nowadays, and so the skills that employers want for their MBA's have moved on.They'll still want some finance skills, but more importantly, they looking for thosedigital skills. You're listening to enrollment growth university from Helix Education, the bestprofessional development podcast for higher education leaders looking to grow enrollment at their college oruniversity. Whether you're looking for fresh enrollment growth techniques and strategies or tools andresources, you've come to the right place. Let's get into the show. Welcomeback to enrollment growth university, a proud member of the connect Du podcastnetwork. I'm Eric Olson with Helix Education and we're here today with Andrew Crisp, cofounder at Carrington Crisp. Andrew, welcome to the show. Hi Eric, good to be here. Really excited to have you here and talk withyou today about the diminishing employer demand for...

...the traditional MBA. But before wedig into that, can you give the listeners a little bit of background onboth Carrington Crisp and your role there? Yes, hi, so I wantedthe CO founders of Carrington Crisp. We set up two thousand and four.I guess it wants two thousand and three that sort of type, specifically towork with business schools on branding issues. Since said, the business has grownquite significantly. We've worked in thirty five countries with about two hundred institutions,mostly business schools still, but a few, why the university clients as well,and a range of projects, all backed by five annual market insight studieswe do which look that the future of NBA's the future of Masters, alongthe relations school branding and digital communication so very embedded in the business education world. I love how your continued research continues to tip off where the NBA continuesto evolve. Ender to kick off this...

...research driven conversation, can you provideus just with a high level overview of your most recent study on the futureof lifelong and executive education? Yes, absolutely, Eric. So we've runa study three times in the last decade looking at executive education and then lastyear, during the pandemic, we did a series of studies on one ofthe things that came up time and time again was the growth of reskilling andupskilling, people staying in the workforce longer, needing to update their skills acquire newskills, and so we put together this study at the beginning of thisyear to look at whether there were connections between executive educational life long learning,how the two might come together in terms of what business as educations are goingto provide the marketplace. And ran a study with linkedin looking at these topicswhere we surveyed about two and a half thousand individual learners around the world andfive hundred employers to get their views on...

...how the market was involving. It'sa fascinating research study. I'd argue. One of the most striking stats,at least to me, that came out of this research is that a forseventy seven percent of those five hundred employers believe that higher ad really needs toreinvent the NBA. Why do you believe that's the case? And maybe,more importantly, reinvent into what? That's a great question. I think thereare a number of drivers here. So we're not talking about the end ofthe NBA. The NBA has become a brand, but brands change. Youjust have to look at the car market and you I'm a say it isor a Jacua. Now they're available as fully electric vehicles and so in thesame way, the NBA brand has to change and I think for employers it'sdriven by a couple of things. First of all, what they find theyneed in terms of skills in their businesses. So you go back a decade,twenty years, and corporate finance was a mainstay at the NBA. It'snot today. Yes, of course finance...

...is still important. Yes, ACcounty is still important, but actually it's technology, it's digital. Is Transformationand every company is a digital business ourdays, and so the skills that employers wantfrom their MBA's have moved on. They'll still want some finance skills,but more importantly, they're looking for those digital skills. The other part ofthis is that employers are reacting to what their customers are saying, and theircustomers are saying business needs to move forward, business needs to play a wider roleacross society rather than seeing itself as a standalone almost and to that endwe're finding time and time again issues like ethics, ethical leadership, responsible management, diversity, equality inclusion, all of these subjects are much more to thefor in terms of what customers are talking about and therefore employers are looking forthat again in their MBA's, and so...

...some significant shifts in terms of thecontent and the positioning as the NBA. You spoke to this concept of forthose employers who have mentally moved on from the NBA, let's talk about that. For those specifically who reference that they don't formally partner with business schools anymoreon their employee of Skilling initiatives, what are some of those alternatives that they'returning to instead? So one of the obvious ones is that the consultancy firms. You look at mckinzie, look at accenture, how you look at Deloyd? They all have their own training academies and if your company is a customerof one of these, then the chances are they'll also be selling you sometraining, some development. But it's not just that the big consulting firms.We're finding a number of corporates launching their own academy. It's a great example. Union Bank of Switzerland UBS now have a training academy which originally, Iguess, began just training UBS staff,...

...but now anybody can pictu up onlineand take a program with them. Very Short, simple, cheap programs ninetynine up to programs that cost thousands of dollars and it works. Because ifyou want to have a career in financial services, then having UBS on yourCV as the brand that batch your training is something that'll be recognized by anyother financial sector employer. So it doesn't have to be one of the traditionalbusiness education writers. It can be a corporate education provider and I think evenbeyond that. You then look at the short course offerings, from course Sarah, from Edex to you, from you to me, from all hosts ormanner of organizations. Is a I read recently an Indian organization which is oneof the largest providers in this marketplace. You then got companies like Meritus aswell, offering sometimes programs that have come...

...from business schools but not now offerdirectly by the school but by this third party. So a real breadth ofproviders in the marketplace that working in a way that employers are interested in thatperhaps isn't available from the traditional business schools. In your on the on the optimisticside, I think. I think one of the good news or atleast silver lining stats they came out of this research to me was when youasked employers about their views on the legitimacy of ourline education versus a traditional inpersonal environment. Can you share more about what came back there? Yes,absolutely, I think. Well, it was happening before the pandemic too.There were signs that more employees were interested. They were buying a corporate services fromsome of these organizations. I just mentioned the course eras and others likethat. But what has happened over the last fifteen, eighteen months is employershave had to work online, they've had...

...their staff working online, they've seenthat actually the productivity has been pretty good, in some cases better than it waswhen people came to the office or or wherever they were working, andso this embrace of all things online has inevitably extended to delivery of development andlearning. Of course. The other benefit for the employer is if people arelearning online, the costs are a lot lower for them, not necessarily thecosts of the fees for the study, but they're not traveling to another location, they don't need accommodation costs, are not perhaps missing out on so muchworktime to do this learning and development. So there are big benefits for employersto embrace online learning alongside traditional routes of learning. With so much recent focuson figuring out moving toward lifelong learning models versus hoping or expecting a four yearcollege stent in a students early s alone...

...will set them up before forever careersuccess. How should institutions align themselves with helping employers figure out what lifeline learningpathway should look like for their employees? Well, the first thing is listen, talk to the employers, hear what they have to say, understand howlearning moves through an organization and moves through a career, that people need differentthings at different times and have that flexibility. So don't expect to go to anemployer and say we do this. Expect to go to an employer andsay so, what is it you want, because we can probably help. Theidea that there is only one way forward. It's it's rather like withdegrees. You know, largely people had to start them at a certain timeas the year and complete them at a certain time as a year. Thatis not the case anymore. There needs to be that flexibility that you know, particularly if somebody is working, then maybe they want to start studying inApril, maybe they want to start studying...

...in January. They're not just goingto study start a degree in all sort of September and they may want todo part of that degree and then stop and then come back and do anotherpart of that degree. There was a great interview last year with the Ministerfor Education in Singapore who talked about the end of linear learning, the ideathat you have to go straight through a program and completed in one go.And I think for those who have dropped out of education perhaps in the past, who've not finish their degree, this is a real opportunity to come backlater on in their lives, maybe five ten years later, and add theskills that they need to complete that qualification or to pick up some new anddifferent skills of the now relevant to the career they have and to the worldof employment, that the labor market that they're part of. So that flexibilityis absolutely key. The other thing that I ought to mention it is brand. Brand is going to be so important going forward because, connected to ourlast point about online learning, employers are...

...certainly open to online learning, butthe one question they ask is who did you learn with? There are alot of not fly by night but maybe not quite as sophisticated providers as employersmight hope they would be. Yeah, so employers want to know that thereputation of the provider, that quality of their content, the pedacogy, theimpact of the learning, all of these are as at the highest order,and that means working with the branded providers, those who know the business of learning, who know the content that is required and have been listening to employersabout what they will need for the future and your tremendous insights. Finally,can you leave us with any high level next steps advice pre institutions who arelooking to better partner with employers on their land initiatives? I think there are. There are two or three things that are important. So the first thingis for a lot of universities their main...

...market has been eighteen year olds,undergraduates, maybe twenty two, twenty three, twenty four year olds will for apostgraduate degree. What they're now having to do, instead of dealing withall of these individuals, is they're dealing with companies, and so moving froma B Toc to a b tob marketplace and having the right people who understandhow to do that is really going to be incredibly important going forward. Secondlyis experiment, take a risk. I spoke to somebody from Oxford University lastyear as part of a piece of research we were doing and they had neverrun an online program certainly not a short course nondegree online program and so theywent to the market place and they ran their first one on Fintech, andI had a salesand people sign up and they now have twenty of these programsrunning multiple times during the year and it's a significant part of the business schooland oxor's revenue stream. But they had...

...to take a risk, they hadto accept that not everything was necessarily going to work first time. So Ithink that's something that's important for universes as well, because they tend to bequite conservative otherwise. And I think the third thing is online office opportunity.It offers opportunity in the sense that your customers need not necessarily be on yourdull step anymore. They could be on the other side of the world,and understanding this learn anywhere at any time market place that is now evolving isreally important if you're going to make the most of the opportunities that I mightbreach it and your tremendous stuff. Thank you so much again for your timetoday. What's the best place for listeners to reach out at they have anyfollow up questions, but well ovious. You find US home linkedin. Notsurprisingly, they can contact us by email INFO at Carrington Crispcom or visit ourwebsite carrying some Crispcom and they'll find a...

...host of information and findings from ourresearch at a little bit more information about the work that we do. IsBusiness Education around the world awesome and your thanks so much for joining us today. My pleasure IC Nice speak to you. Attracting today's new post traditional learners meansadopting new enrollment strategies. Helix educations data driven, enterprise wide approach toenrollment growth is uniquely helping colleges and universities thrive in this new education landscape,and Helix has just published the second edition of their enrollment growth playbook with fiftypercent brand new content on how institutions can solve today's most pressing enrollment growth challenges, downloaded today for free at Helix Educationcom. Playbook. You've been listening to enrollmentgrowth university from Helix Education. To ensure that you never miss an episode, subscribe to the shown itunes or your...

...favorite podcast player. Thank you somuch for listening. Until next time,.

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